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	<title>Comments on: Australian Christian Churches: Growing and Slowing</title>
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	<link>http://www.movements.net/2009/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html</link>
	<description>The companion website to the new book by Steve Addison</description>
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		<title>By: Josh</title>
		<link>http://www.movements.net/2009/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html/comment-page-1#comment-201318</link>
		<dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 04:22:05 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Steve B - if its not over can I declare you a false prophet? It would seem accurate to do so. 

I would say to suppose that Hillsong or the ACC (AoG) is primarily focussed around music is near sighted and misguided. Sure the &#039;famous&#039; part of Hillsong is the music but the church is not about music, it is about the kingdom. Music is a reflection of what is happening in the heart of believers both experientially, theologically and prophetically. 

In no way would I say Hillsong is the perfect church and in many regards my church is intentionally different as we follow what we believe God has called us to but the tall poppy syndrome is both sickening and far from Godly.

The beauty of the AoG is that Pastors can lead their churches in expressions that are totally different from the large churches. The freedom to operate is vastly better than any other movement I know of. In planting in Canberra my church put down roots only around the corner from another AoG (alot different in expression and vision) and that is not only allowed (as no one has control over where some one plants) but that Church attended our launch on the Sunday morning. The Pastor has been one of the most kingdom minded people I have ever met. And neither of us are clones of Hillsong. Together in our unity and diversity we reachout as coworkers with each other and Christ to extend his kingdom. 

There are too many rocks being thrown instead of using those rocks to build the kingdom. Pick up one and started building.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve B &#8211; if its not over can I declare you a false prophet? It would seem accurate to do so. </p>
<p>I would say to suppose that Hillsong or the ACC (AoG) is primarily focussed around music is near sighted and misguided. Sure the &#8216;famous&#8217; part of Hillsong is the music but the church is not about music, it is about the kingdom. Music is a reflection of what is happening in the heart of believers both experientially, theologically and prophetically. </p>
<p>In no way would I say Hillsong is the perfect church and in many regards my church is intentionally different as we follow what we believe God has called us to but the tall poppy syndrome is both sickening and far from Godly.</p>
<p>The beauty of the AoG is that Pastors can lead their churches in expressions that are totally different from the large churches. The freedom to operate is vastly better than any other movement I know of. In planting in Canberra my church put down roots only around the corner from another AoG (alot different in expression and vision) and that is not only allowed (as no one has control over where some one plants) but that Church attended our launch on the Sunday morning. The Pastor has been one of the most kingdom minded people I have ever met. And neither of us are clones of Hillsong. Together in our unity and diversity we reachout as coworkers with each other and Christ to extend his kingdom. </p>
<p>There are too many rocks being thrown instead of using those rocks to build the kingdom. Pick up one and started building.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.movements.net/2009/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html/comment-page-1#comment-201271</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2009 04:51:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.steveaddison.net/2010/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html#comment-201271</guid>
		<description>Mark

The movement to institution drift is a problem for every movement including the ACC. Here&#039;s what happened to early Christianity after it went mainstream and became a &quot;church of influence&quot;. 

http://www.steveaddison.net/2005/07/07/how-it-was-undone.html

A movement at the height of its success is most vulnerable. Yes, Driscoll is right, release those young, innovative apostolic types. The danger is the centralize and control rather than risk and release.

Every movement has faced this challenge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark</p>
<p>The movement to institution drift is a problem for every movement including the ACC. Here&#8217;s what happened to early Christianity after it went mainstream and became a &#8220;church of influence&#8221;. </p>
<p><a href="http://www.steveaddison.net/2005/07/07/how-it-was-undone.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.steveaddison.net/2005/07/07/how-it-was-undone.html</a></p>
<p>A movement at the height of its success is most vulnerable. Yes, Driscoll is right, release those young, innovative apostolic types. The danger is the centralize and control rather than risk and release.</p>
<p>Every movement has faced this challenge.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://www.movements.net/2009/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html/comment-page-1#comment-201270</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2009 02:49:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.steveaddison.net/2010/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html#comment-201270</guid>
		<description>I attend an ACC (AOG) church and have done since I was saved there in 2000. I have noticed that as the church has grown numerically the &quot;signs and wonders&quot; kind of stuff has dried up a bit, I think it might be because it is harder to manage from a logisitical and time perspective with a larger group of people. Kind of sad. 

I have been listening to Mark Driscoll on church planting recently and he was talking about a movement becoming an institution then a museum. Happens when the young, innovative apostolic types aren&#039;t raised up and released by the old dudes who used to be that way. So the young guys leave and start there own thing.

Is this kind of what you were talking about Steve?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I attend an ACC (AOG) church and have done since I was saved there in 2000. I have noticed that as the church has grown numerically the &#8220;signs and wonders&#8221; kind of stuff has dried up a bit, I think it might be because it is harder to manage from a logisitical and time perspective with a larger group of people. Kind of sad. </p>
<p>I have been listening to Mark Driscoll on church planting recently and he was talking about a movement becoming an institution then a museum. Happens when the young, innovative apostolic types aren&#8217;t raised up and released by the old dudes who used to be that way. So the young guys leave and start there own thing.</p>
<p>Is this kind of what you were talking about Steve?</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.movements.net/2009/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html/comment-page-1#comment-201253</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 05:52:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.steveaddison.net/2010/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html#comment-201253</guid>
		<description>Mark, good question. Here&#039;s some distinctives Pentecostalism should keep returning to in an innovative way:

http://www.steveaddison.net/2006/04/25/reasons-1-3-for-pentecostal-success.html

http://www.steveaddison.net/2006/04/26/reasons-4-7-for-pentecostal-success.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark, good question. Here&#8217;s some distinctives Pentecostalism should keep returning to in an innovative way:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.steveaddison.net/2006/04/25/reasons-1-3-for-pentecostal-success.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.steveaddison.net/2006/04/25/reasons-1-3-for-pentecostal-success.html</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.steveaddison.net/2006/04/26/reasons-4-7-for-pentecostal-success.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.steveaddison.net/2006/04/26/reasons-4-7-for-pentecostal-success.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://www.movements.net/2009/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html/comment-page-1#comment-201251</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 05:29:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.steveaddison.net/2010/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html#comment-201251</guid>
		<description>Hi Steve - what is the innovative return to tradition? Church planting and reaching the lost?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Steve &#8211; what is the innovative return to tradition? Church planting and reaching the lost?</p>
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		<title>By: Josh</title>
		<link>http://www.movements.net/2009/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html/comment-page-1#comment-201194</link>
		<dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 May 2009 13:28:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.steveaddison.net/2010/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html#comment-201194</guid>
		<description>I have read the reports (I am an AoG/ACC pastor) and planter and whilst elements concern me in regards to churches being planted I think you will find FAR MORE were planted but the rate of closures, churches removed, churches leaving the movement etc were also too high. (my experience has been alot of closures are actually smaller ethnic churches with a propensity to split and close with the dynamic nature of the new small communities) 

There are certainly cultural changes as such in regards to the view of what a successful church plant and church is like but to draw the conclusions you have drawn seems some what detached.

There is no evidence there is a plateau coming in the long term however I agree that more churches need to be planted of course. The AoG went through a dip in the growth rate in the nineties as well but then picked back up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have read the reports (I am an AoG/ACC pastor) and planter and whilst elements concern me in regards to churches being planted I think you will find FAR MORE were planted but the rate of closures, churches removed, churches leaving the movement etc were also too high. (my experience has been alot of closures are actually smaller ethnic churches with a propensity to split and close with the dynamic nature of the new small communities) </p>
<p>There are certainly cultural changes as such in regards to the view of what a successful church plant and church is like but to draw the conclusions you have drawn seems some what detached.</p>
<p>There is no evidence there is a plateau coming in the long term however I agree that more churches need to be planted of course. The AoG went through a dip in the growth rate in the nineties as well but then picked back up.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve B</title>
		<link>http://www.movements.net/2009/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html/comment-page-1#comment-201147</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 22:56:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.steveaddison.net/2010/05/02/australian-christian-churches-growing-and-slowing.html#comment-201147</guid>
		<description>PROPHECY:  IT&#039;S OVER.  

Considering it&#039;s primariily focused around music ministry, it is like ABBA.  While Hillsong has been a blessing for the global church in many ways, eventually it becomes boring &amp; the your consumers in the auditoriums will look for something else.    Time for good rethink...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PROPHECY:  IT&#8217;S OVER.  </p>
<p>Considering it&#8217;s primariily focused around music ministry, it is like ABBA.  While Hillsong has been a blessing for the global church in many ways, eventually it becomes boring &amp; the your consumers in the auditoriums will look for something else.    Time for good rethink&#8230;</p>
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